SPFPP 415: I Don’t Know a Life Without Herpes
I have many things to say about this podcast episode including that no matter how hard I tried to balance the heaviness with humor and personality, you can still see and hear the frustration from me regarding our guest’s story. I so appreciate her revisiting this traumatizing memory for the sake of helping others who may have a shared experince. I hope you listen and are able to see things from a different perspective just as I have been able to.
SPFPP 415: Surviving Trauma & Healing the Inner Child with Reina
Trigger Warning: This episode contains discussions of childhood sexual abuse, incest, and suicide attempts. Please take care of yourself while listening.
What does it take to survive the darkest of circumstances and still choose to live a life rooted in love and forgiveness? This week, Courtney Brame sits down with Reina, a board member of Herpes Cure Advocacy, for an incredibly raw, unedited, and deeply moving conversation about surviving compounding trauma.
Contracting HSV at just five years old due to childhood sexual assault, Reina shares her journey through profound denial, the struggle to articulate her pain to medical professionals, and the eventual breaking point that led to a near-fatal suicide attempt. Reina opens up about how escaping a toxic environment, overcoming alcohol dependency, and finding her faith allowed her to finally stop running from her past. Now 26 years after her exposure, Reina explains why she chooses radical forgiveness, how she navigates dating and disclosure with unapologetic confidence, and why true healing begins with apologizing to your inner child.
Links & Resources Mentioned:
Connect with Herpes Cure Advocacy: herpescureadvocacy.com
Subscribe to the SPFPP Newsletter
Full Transcript
Intro and SPFPP Announcements
00:00:00 Courtney Brame: Hello, welcome to Something Positive for Positive People. I'm Courtney Brame. Something Positive for Positive People is a 501(c)(3) nonprofit organization supporting people who are navigating herpes stigma. A couple of quick announcements before we get into today's podcast episode, which has a guest that's willing to put her face out there.
Well, I guess it's not super uncommon that I have a guest that's willing to have their face out there and on camera, but it's not been consistent. Let's say that. So, if you're someone who is okay with speaking about your experience with herpes and navigating stigma, I would love to have you be a guest on the podcast. I do not want to interview people anonymously anymore. I don't care what your first name is. I can call you whatever, but I have no reason to say your name on the podcast episode, to be completely honest. We're two people who are having a conversation together. Neither of us should have any reason to say each other's name.
00:00:52 Courtney Brame: But it feels like over the years of evolution of Something Positive for Positive People, there's no longer a need to have to create that comfort for people to be willing to just anonymously say whatever it is that they want. I don't really ask for much more than just being able to have a conversation about your experience with herpes the same way that people are offering it to those of us who need it, needed it, or will need it. It's just one way to reciprocate some type of energy into the community, into the space, to be able to support people in their own healing.
Now, a couple of quick announcements. The Herpes Stigma Expo for the fall is in New York City. It is on August 29th, which is a Saturday, and it will go from 11:00 a.m. until about 6:00 p.m. It's just a day of support. I look forward to being able to get people to show up, meet each other, mingle, have food together, role play some rejection handling, as well as some fun stuff in regards to speaking about sex, sexual health, and pleasure.
00:02:03 Courtney Brame: And then we'll do a little bit of yoga. So, if that's something you're interested in, visit spfpp.org/expo. This is the last one that I am planning to do. Things are going to be looking different as we close out 2026 and enter 2027, but those are things that you'll hear throughout different variations of intros for the podcast that come to be.
Introducing Reina and Herpes Cure Advocacy
Courtney Brame: So I mentioned we have a guest and I am going to let our guest introduce themselves and then share how we connected. And then we're going to take it old school. We're gonna do the podcast the way that we used to always do it when I had like four guests over the course of a week and three interviews in a day. So we're jump-starting how things used to be. Go on ahead.
00:02:46 Courtney Brame: Reina, I'll have you introduce yourself however you want to be introduced. We can talk about how we met and then we'll just transition into the conversation. Sounds good.
Reina: So, my name is Reina Samaru. You cook. Why? Because am I looking at the camera or am I looking at you explaining?
00:03:05 Courtney Brame: Don't worry about that. Listen, this is real. This is—
Reina: Are you going to edit this?
Courtney Brame: No, I'm not.
Reina: Why?
Courtney Brame: Because I don't edit the podcast. It takes time.
Reina: Are you serious?
Courtney Brame: I'm so serious. You're good.
00:03:17 Courtney Brame: This is what happens. This is what Something Positive for Positive People is. We don't do perfect. We don't do performance. We show up and we do our best and what we got is what we got. Okay?
Reina: All right. Okay. Well, my name is Reina Samaru. I'm from Indiana and I work at a bank.
Courtney Brame: That's like what you told me about Herpes Cure Advocacy. You were like, "We advocate for a herpes cure and we're in LA." And that was it. Straight to the point.
00:03:47 Courtney Brame: But you're one of the board members on the organization Herpes Cure Advocacy, right?
Reina: Yes, I am.
Courtney Brame: And how did you come into that position?
Reina: I was looking for support groups and I found HCA. I reached out to one of the members there looking for support and it just kind of happened. They asked, "Would you be interested in being a board member?" and I'm like, "I guess."
00:04:12 Courtney Brame: Oh, that's similar to my recruiting process. I'll make friends with people and I see that they're consistent in what they do, that they care about what they do. And over the years, what started as, "Oh, you care about this thing, too? Great. Would you like to be a board member?" became more of me looking at how invested someone is in the community, in the space, and in their own craft before bringing them in to work together.
I've even gotten that way with podcast guests. And I think that's what stood out about you. When you were at the table, I got to hear and see you engaging with the people who were coming up with curiosity about the organization.
00:04:57 Courtney Brame: In the conversation, how knowledgeable you seemed—that was what made me decide, "Oh, this might make a really good fit for a podcast guest." So thanks for being here.
Reina: Well, thanks for having me.
Courtney Brame: And just for perspective, we're at the 2026 STI Prevention Conference here in Atlanta, Georgia.
00:05:15 Courtney Brame: And this is your first time here, right?
Reina: Yeah, first time in Atlanta.
Courtney Brame: How are you enjoying it?
Reina: I love it. Yeah, first time at the conference. I met so many people, had great conversations.
Courtney Brame: All right. So, we talked a little bit beforehand about your experience, and then that's when I cut you off. So, can you tell us as comfortably as you are with your experience with getting diagnosed with herpes? And then this is officially where the interview begins.
00:05:50 Reina: Okay. That's not me. That's next door.
Courtney Brame: That was me, huh?
Reina: Yeah. Oops.
Courtney Brame: Pretty sure I put the do not disturb thing on there and have checkout for like an hour from now. But it's all good. I told you this is how we do it.
00:06:05 Courtney Brame: This is the podcast. This is how it's going to go.
A Childhood Diagnosis
Reina: Yep. So, this is my first interview about herpes in general. It's something that I'd never really wanted to touch base on for a long time. So, I've been carrying HSV for about 25 to 26 years now.
00:06:24 Reina: I got it when I was 5 years old and obviously I didn't know what the hell it was. There was a time where I diagnosed myself as like a 12-year-old, just going to the library looking up s*** on the internet or finding books about sex education. And for the longest time, I was like, "Oh, I must have HPV." Because I was reading about that mostly in books.
00:06:53 Reina: Not a lot of herpes references were in the things that I had come across. I remember when I got my first Pap smear done, I was like maybe 15. They never said anything to me. You want to know what the gynecologist asked? She's like, "Have you ever been raped?" And that was the first time that I covered for my abusers and I didn't stick up for myself. I'll never forget that. I have forgiven myself, but it took me a long time because that was a moment where I should have spoken up and said something. But I was too afraid to tell her what happened. So I told her no.
00:07:32 Reina: And she never even diagnosed me. I didn't get a firm confirmation of it until I think I was about 20 years old. Somebody told me I had herpes for the first time at age 20. Yeah. But I always knew, you know what I mean? I always knew.
00:07:50 Courtney Brame: Exposed at five. Researched at 12. Doctor's visit Pap smear at 15 and then at age 20 was when a gynecologist told you, "You have herpes." But you had already known. So again, as comfortable as you are with sharing... diagnosed at five.
Reina: Yes.
00:08:16 Courtney Brame: Can you tell me about that?
Reina: You want me to tell you about that experience?
Courtney Brame: Only if you want to.
Reina: It's kind of messed up. It's messed up. So, I was SA-ed by my older brother. He gave it to me.
00:08:43 Reina: And then from that moment on, I can remember the onset of herpes, the outbreak, the denial of family members, my mother not wanting to help me navigate through it, the pain. I mean, it was awful. It hit me pretty hard just like anybody else, I'm sure.
00:09:09 Reina: And it was just something that we never spoke about. A lot of other things unfolded in that household. We were latchkey kids. We had a single mother who wasn't there and she was never sober. It was just something that I lived with and I thought was okay.
00:09:31 Reina: That's all I knew. That was where I was from. And I had to look at the face of somebody that took my innocence, took my virginity, gave me herpes, and she always kept him around because that was her son. I have forgiveness in my heart, though. I think he was about 15. Somebody hurt him, too.
00:09:54 Reina: That doesn't negate what happened to me. That doesn't make it right, or wrong. Two types of hurt people. There are the ones that hurt people and then there's ones like me. I've always strived so hard never to be like them, try to hold on to what I thought I still have, which was my heart.
00:10:30 Reina: I always choose to forgive, try to understand. Doesn't mean I have to be around people that hurt me, but I just understand the brokenness that people carry. You know what I mean? I've never done any of those things to anybody. Matter of fact, the things that were done to me, I would never do to anybody else because I know how it feels.
00:11:14 Courtney Brame: How you feel? I feel like I'm trying to figure out where else to go with that. You go wherever you need to.
Reina: So, that's how I got it. It was a journey maneuvering through that, figuring out what to do there. For a long time, I was in denial.
00:11:34 Reina: I couldn't even say it to myself because I always felt like it never belonged to me. I wouldn't have got it on my own. That's the type of things I said to myself, you know. But I stand in my truth now. I have nothing to lose.
00:11:52 Reina: It has been a crazy journey. But anyway, ultimately all those years led me up to where I'm at today in Atlanta, wanting to be a voice for other people, wanting to share my testimony to let people know that you can make it out on the other side.
Take a breath.
00:12:26 Courtney Brame: Thank you for sharing. For revisiting that, because I know whenever I have to think about a thing, I'm there again. And for you sharing your story when you wrote your bio on the Herpes Cure Advocacy page under your description as a board member, when you share this story, when you're talking about it now on the podcast, you revisit that moment. Does it get easier?
00:12:59 Courtney Brame: Does it feel different for you in taking this traumatic experience and using it as a tool for helping other people to navigate through their own traumatic experience?
Reina: Yeah, when I revisit it now it's a perspective shift. Because throughout the years, if I thought about it, I would try to numb it away, drink it away.
00:13:24 Reina: But now I revisit it as an apology to the little girl in me. Like, I'm sorry I wasn't strong enough to stick up for you. And not only for her, but for anybody else. I want to show up for her then and now and be strong enough to help others. And I want the truth out.
00:13:52 Reina: I want my truth out. I felt so silenced. It's been a lot. I feel freer than I ever have being so open. Like what do I have to be afraid of? You know what I mean?
00:14:20 Reina: The worst has already come to pass. Why not tell the truth? Take what I say with a grain of salt.
Courtney Brame: How long have you been open about your experience?
Reina: For a couple years since I got sober.
Courtney Brame: Sober from what?
Reina: Alcohol.
00:14:42 Reina: About three, four years ago, I quit drinking and that was a struggle because that was my crutch. That's what I used to drown my memories out or flashbacks, thoughts or whatever. Escapism, it was. And then I was just sick and tired of my own s***.
00:15:03 Reina: Nobody else was going to stop me from drinking. And I already know that in the end, nobody's going to save you, but still... I had to get sober. And I had to stay sober. I had to sit with all that and go through the motions and be stronger to think about it, to talk about it, to feel those things and stop running and lying to myself that everything was okay when it wasn't. When I never addressed it.
Did I answer your question?
00:15:36 Courtney Brame: You did. What made you decide to stop drinking and did that influence your ability and willingness to engage with what you had been repressing?
Reina: What stopped me from drinking first? Drunk Reina is not a happy drunk.
00:16:06 Reina: I'm a very aggressive drunk, violent and just angry. And the last time I got drunk, I kind of wigged out on somebody. Nobody is dead, but I found myself just like—I was so fragmented at that last time I got drunk, everything was so fragmented.
00:16:49 Reina: The person that was in front of me, I thought it was my attacker. I thought I was somewhere else when I wasn't. And that's why they call alcohol "spirits" because I swear you let that in, it's just not good. The next morning, everybody was still alive,
00:17:13 Reina: but I just felt so scared of myself and I just didn't want to do it again. So, that same year I went and got baptized and I decided I was going to leave everything behind in the watery grave. I was made new and I was going to tell the truth.
00:17:45 Reina: I was going to my truth and I wasn't going to do it again. And whoever the sun sets free is free indeed.
Finding Faith and Forgiveness
Courtney Brame: How'd you find your faith?
Reina: It found me. I swear. Going to church on Sunday wasn't something we did as a family.
00:18:10 Reina: But there was a church bus that would drive around the neighborhood and knock on people's doors or ask kids, "You want to go to church today?" I always got on the church bus. I always went to church. I didn't know anything about God, but I always went. I've been in and out of my faith for a lot of years, too.
00:18:33 Reina: I think now I got a good relationship with it. I think it balances me out. I don't need anybody to middleman my relationship with God, but it means something to me. I feel like if it wasn't for God, I wouldn't be who I am today. I don't look like anything that I walked through.
00:19:01 Reina: Because what you see before you today is nothing but the handiwork of the Lord. He restores and I can make it through the fire and still seem like a well-put-together person just from first sight without even talking to me. I think there's some power behind that. But for whomever, you know, whatever works for you.
00:19:30 Reina: I just felt like I needed something to believe into so I clung on to that.
Courtney Brame: Was there a real point where you blamed either not having faith or a relationship with God, or blamed God for the trauma that happened to you?
Reina: Yeah. Yeah.
Courtney Brame: How did you wrestle with that?
00:19:52 Reina: I was mad at him. I was mad. Why me? What did I do? Especially when I was a little girl. What did I do? I've done enough now, by now. But what did I do then? You know, I think just reading his word and allowing it to resonate somehow, sit with it.
00:20:21 Reina: Every time I read his word, it speaks to me differently. And that's just for me. I may never know why he wrote my story the way that he did. I just got to trust him. It sounded a whole lot better than doing what I was doing about the situation anyway.
00:20:41 Reina: So, he's gotten me this far. Trust me, I'm okay with it. It is what it is. Yeah, it's a part of my story and it is part of who I am and I do love myself now. I treat myself better. I'm not perfect. I have a lot to work on.
00:21:05 Reina: I have trust issues. But when it comes to me being able to sit with myself, my thoughts in my own silence, I have comfortability there.
Courtney Brame: Whereas before you didn't have that?
Reina: No. That's where the alcohol came in. Yeah, I was always running from everything, running from myself, running from the past.
00:21:32 Reina: Then I decided finally to turn around and give it a black eye because I'm tired of running. I'm too old to be running.
Courtney Brame: What made you decide that you needed to stop running? And what did that perspective shift look like?
Reina: I said, I need to heal. I need to address it.
00:21:53 Reina: I need to face it. And whatever that means to me, talking about it, writing it down, helping others.
Courtney Brame: That's what I was going to ask next, right? Like what does facing it look like for you? When you say stop running, turn around, punch it, give it a black eye.
00:22:14 Courtney Brame: This ain't no normal trauma, right? It's not like you were just diagnosed with herpes because someone didn't tell you. This is compounded with incest, sexual assault, abuse as a kid, and the family dynamic—the whole "what happens in his house stays in his house."
00:22:41 Courtney Brame: There's a lot of s*** there. Not feeling protected by your mom, anger with God for letting this happen. And having to go through all of this when someone is ready to kill themselves because they had a one night stand drunkenly and they got herpes. And here you are before us, 25, 26 years after your herpes diagnosis with all of the things that came with it... and you're here.
00:23:10 Courtney Brame: So, I guess the thing that I'm looking to get out of this here is that there's something—I don't have a word for it. It's not strength. It's not courage. It's not bravery. It's something else. Maybe will is the word that allowed for you to go through these compounded traumas, endure those compounded traumas... And now here you are not breaking down, crying, having not killed yourself.
00:23:56 Courtney Brame: I can say this on the podcast, it probably won't make it on social media, but like having not killed yourself, having not like... you feel at whatever your baseline is.
Reina: Yeah. I mean, there's levels to this s***. I feel like I've walked through them all in a sense. The stigma, the shame, the embarrassment, not being able to look at myself in the mirror for years.
00:24:27 Reina: It was the ultimate betrayal for sure. And I did try to kill myself. When I was 17, I just could not deal with it anymore. I felt like everything was against me. There is a place, it's like a quarry and a ledges kind of situation.
00:24:56 Reina: You can hike or you could camp and swim on the other side. Unfortunately, a lot of people die there yearly. And some people go there willingly to do that. Some people accidentally do it. I decided to climb up as high as I could. They have trail marks.
00:25:13 Reina: It was green, yellow, and red. Red is the most advanced. I'm just hopping around hoping that I fall. And I did. I fell. They estimated probably roughly around 30 f****** feet I fell. It was crazy. Everything went in slow motion. And once I hit the ground, I went into like a seizure, but I literally saw the light.
00:25:39 Reina: It's cuz my arms were straight up in the air when I came back to and I was still fishing out from the seizure because I had hit my head. But that was the most powerful spiritual feeling I've ever had. This has come from that thought that psychedelics would help with my trauma.
00:25:57 Reina: So, I delved into a lot of that too at one point, but nothing compared to that near-death experience for me. But even after that, it was rough. You know, I was in a wheelchair. I fractured my pelvis. I broke my ankle. I had lacerations on my feet and my hands.
00:26:21 Reina: I was in the hospital for like 3 days. Nobody came to see me. You know, the nurses had to find clothes for me and take me a shower cuz they had left me in all my blood. They were like, "We need to know who your parent is." I know her name. I told them their name.
00:26:39 Reina: She didn't show up. When she finally did, she was f***** up. Came with one of her friends. I think a couple hours later, my siblings came and nobody talked to me. I didn't do it because I wanted them to finally be there for me.
00:27:03 Reina: I did it because I was at that point in my life, I was just f****** done. I was just done. Didn't care, you know? And then somehow I survived it. I think a week before somebody died, and they didn't even fall that high. It wasn't even that high.
00:27:23 Reina: And I climb up like 30 feet and I'm still here. What the hell? It was mad, you know. So I think I just accepted everything after that. Yeah, I was in a wheelchair. I couldn't walk for a while.
00:27:45 Reina: I was kind of couch surfing in a wheelchair with my dog. It wasn't safe for me to be at my house for a long time. And I was able to walk again. I had some people that were sent to me to help me get on my feet. I was 17 at that time.
00:28:06 Reina: 18, 19 were the last two years I spent in my hometown. But I was able to get mobile again. Then I moved to Indiana and that's where I truly believe my life began. I still struggled with things, but my life truly began when I got out of that situation.
00:28:34 Reina: I got to see healthy family dynamics, work around people that just have big hearts and loved people, strangers. I mean, I'm a stray cat. I joke about saying that because I move around a lot and I have a privilege to meet some really genuine people along the way and not everybody is like the people that I came from.
00:29:02 Reina: And that gives me hope. I have not tried to kill myself since. That was the only time that I've ever tried to kill myself. I just accepted it, I think. To wrap around back to what I said about not knowing why my story was written the way it was in the beginning...
00:29:27 Reina: I think he just made me so strong to carry such weight. It's intentional because I can handle a lot of pressure but still be solid like right here.
Courtney Brame: That's the story that you tell yourself is that this had a reason. And I'm sitting here, even since you said it, there is no world where a 5-year-old has done anything to earn this karma or deserve to be battle-tested for whatever is to come after that.
00:30:12 Reina: Yeah.
Courtney Brame: And I'm struggling. I can't see that. And this is coming from a person who I have my own relationship with spirit, God, higher power and everything. And to sit across from you and watch you tell this story with a straight face and say like, "This is the story..."
00:30:40 Courtney Brame: It is in fact challenging me to not be as closed-minded, regardless of how open-minded I think I am. Being closed-minded to the idea that there's something good even to come on the other side of something that is as not good as that. I don't know if that makes sense, but I'm trying. Because normally I can translate s*** in a way that makes sense and that's not what you are embodying.
00:31:16 Courtney Brame: I can't translate that s*** really.
Reina: Yeah.
Courtney Brame: Because this is something that happened to you and now here we are again 26 years later. This thing that happened to you allows for something useful, powerful, helpful to happen through you.
Reina: Exactly. For the world to experience. Yeah.
00:31:38 Reina: It was intended for evil, but I'm using it for good. Finally taking that ownership, going through the motions of having herpes, wearing my badges of honor when I get my flare-ups, taking care of that s***, taking ownership of that. I could either sit here and continue to blame them and hate them and hate God, but that's not going to change anything because it ain't going anywhere.
00:32:14 Reina: Whereas I can tend to these issues. I can nurture myself and love myself and I show up for me. I always have. I am everything to me in the sense of I am my own mother, my own father, my own brother and my own sister. I am my own grandparents.
00:32:33 Reina: I am my cousin. I am my best friend. I rely on me and the higher source to trust, to know that I got this. I'm good. I'll figure it out. I'll get by just fine. Happy for a reason. I'm just trying to be led on the right path.
The Purpose of Sharing and Living Free
00:33:03 Courtney Brame: Now, do you have conversations with people about herpes? Like if they're newly diagnosed and they're struggling with stigma?
Reina: I have not.
Courtney Brame: Okay. I have not. Cuz I'm very curious how you would handle someone who is ready to kill themselves because they tested positive with no symptoms.
00:33:26 Courtney Brame: They just went to the doctor and wanted to know if they had herpes cuz my perspective is like, that's it? Like that's my visceral response.
Reina: It's crazy because I don't know life without it, right? I don't know life without it. You know what I mean? So, it's like there is life after it, you know?
00:33:51 Reina: And the thing is is that I'm not the only one. There's babies that are born with it. Born with it, you know? I mean, given the circumstances, right? The way that it came about.
Courtney Brame: Yeah. Like how you at 17, 12 years after being sexually assaulted, getting herpes, decided, "f*** this, I'm out." For someone who's 30,
00:34:20 Courtney Brame: 40, tests positive, maybe within a relationship, getting tested, right, and they're like, "f*** this. I'm out." You know? I look at Reddit... I don't look at the online stuff anymore, but I remember when I was first diagnosed and looking at what people were saying and they were just like, "This is the worst thing that's ever happened to me and I can't do this."
00:34:50 Courtney Brame: "I can't go on like this." And they don't know anything different and they only know the experiences that they've had leading up to their diagnosis. So, you would think that as an adult on the other side of a diagnosis, you'd just be able to adjust.
00:35:11 Courtney Brame: As a kid, I guess you don't know that there's a life without this, right? And so again this is one of those things where I'm hearing from you: It's a choice. It's a choice how I decide to move forward, right? It's a choice to decide to move forward.
00:35:28 Courtney Brame: And what I want to do here is translate this in a way that someone who's newly diagnosed and hearing this is able to receive it without feeling invalidated in their own experience by me because I'm the one that's doing this. I want to end my life, it seems so insignificant of an experience from that person—not to invalidate anybody's experience, but compared to what it could be, without making it seem like, "Well, at least it's not dot dot dot." Does that make sense?
00:36:20 Reina: Yeah. Yeah, it does. Well, it is a choice.
00:36:20 Reina: There's life after it. But again, there's levels to this. And I don't want to say it like, "Oh, you know, it's going to be something that's going to take you the rest of your life." And it may, I don't know. But I mean, I'm still healing from everything, too.
00:36:33 Reina: You know what I mean? It's a process. Something like that that happened to me, it probably is going to take a lifetime of work. But that's where another choice comes in. You got to do the work. You got to put the work in. You got to do the work.
00:36:57 Reina: Nobody's going to do it for you in the end. Nobody's going to come and save you in the end. You got to make that choice. I can't change it. I can't go back in time. I don't know. I don't know what to tell someone that cuz nobody could tell me anything though.
00:37:25 Reina: That's the thing. You couldn't tell me nothing. I would just encourage people to love themselves as much as possible through it all. I found that because of it... Why you playing with that water bottle like that?
Courtney Brame: Because of it. Because of it. Don't get me off track.
00:37:51 Reina: Because of it, I have always sought after things to love myself better, like doing yoga, eating healthier, just being conscientious of the things that I put in my body or on my body. And so, you know, it just made me get closer to myself and love myself for it. What a blessing in disguise.
00:38:13 Courtney Brame: Mhm. See, and when I do hear from people... don't nobody want to hear that s***. The silver lining, the blessing in disguise, the "on the other end of this." Like, what do you want to hear? "Yeah, that s***'s f***** up. Yeah."
00:38:30 Courtney Brame: "F*** herpes, man. Yeah. F*** that s***. You kidding me? It's modern day leprosy. Hell yeah. That s*** ruined my f****** life." What do you mean? Go on. But what am I gonna do? Be f****** pissed.
00:38:42 Courtney Brame: I'm just gonna walk around mad as f***. "Don't look at me. I got herpes." The f***. No, man. You carry yourself better than that. What are some of the experiences that you've had, I guess, on the other side of this through dating, navigating relationships?
00:38:57 Courtney Brame: Because yes, there's herpes and there's incest, being a survivor of incest. Yes, there's also the abuse. There's the relationship with your family dynamic as well. How has herpes at all influenced this? And has this influenced it more than those other things?
Reina: It's influenced the way that I approach relationships.
00:39:20 Courtney Brame: Is that what you're saying? I'm asking.
Reina: Oh, you asking how? Yeah. Well, it's not something I lead with. You know what I mean? Like number one, I don't share straws or silverware with people period. I just don't do that.
00:39:35 Reina: But if I'm invited to somebody's house, right, and they want to have me over for dinner or whatever, and we just became friends, I'm just there to experience them and each other and just get to know one another.
00:39:52 Reina: And I read the room, you know what I mean? I don't lead with that. I just read the room and if we continue to be friends, then it's something that I decide to disclose. But it's not like I'm sleeping with them. Now, when it comes to somebody that I'm interested in, I'll go on a couple dates just to see how it feels.
00:40:20 Reina: And if we both want the same thing, I let them know. I mean, I'm 31 now, at this point, I'm really not afraid to have those conversations with somebody. I'm not afraid to disclose it to anybody. You got a problem with it, I'll leave right now.
00:40:39 Reina: That's okay. You know, I've already been called whatever for it. I've already been made to feel bad and all kinds of things for it before. I don't want to say I have a hardened heart because I don't. But I have thick skin. If you got a problem with it, I will gladly leave.
00:40:57 Reina: I don't care. That's fine. That's your opinion. We're all entitled to it. You feel that way? Cool. I won't be here.
Courtney Brame: And I guess like has dating been a challenge for you from the herpes perspective or is it challenging at all for you, like your relationship with men even?
00:41:14 Reina: Yeah. Yeah. I couldn't tell you the last time I was in a real relationship. Real like, you know, we're together, right? I think I have revisited a person before in my life from growing up because we both just know that we have herpes and we're just kind of at that place.
00:41:45 Reina: You know what I mean? Where it's like can't find anybody right now and I don't f****** feel like going down that rabbit hole. Sometimes it's tiring, you know? Yeah. See, right. You know what I mean? Like you'd be like, "I'll just..." But they've kind of dwindled because at this point I have not really been making that a priority. Haven't made it a priority to date or to be taking anybody seriously.
00:42:15 Reina: So yeah, it made it hard to find, I guess, true love, real love. I have felt like, oh, I didn't want to hurt anybody or expose them to this.
00:42:27 Reina: I have felt all those things. I know how that feels. I don't feel like I'm robbing myself, though. I feel content with taking my time. But also, you know what? For me now, when people flirt with me, I just really do not care for it.
00:42:53 Reina: I'm like, "Okay, what's up?" Like, get to the point. Yeah. Like, "Oh, you beautiful. Thank you. What are you doing? Nothing." You know what I mean?
00:43:05 Reina: For me, it's an energy thing. I got to have that connection immediately. And that rarely happens for me anymore. I don't know. Did I answer any of those questions?
Courtney Brame: Well, yeah. Kind of. Yeah, because the way that you said that, I'm thinking about it now as a lot of people are so ready to overly explain themselves when they do get into a place of discussing their herpes status with someone. It's, "Hey, you know, just so you know, I have herpes.
00:43:52 Courtney Brame: I got it when I was this old. This was what happened to me. It wasn't my fault. Here are the statistics." And they get very overly explanatory. They begin to explain all of these things that no one asked for.
00:44:06 Courtney Brame: And it's not a discussion. It's more of a dump of "I got herpes. Here's all the information." versus what I'm hearing in this is like you're sharing what's relevant when it's relevant and you don't feel like you have to go into the details of how you got it and all of that.
00:44:25 Reina: Exactly. Yeah. Only if I feel like it's something that I want to share. You know what I mean? So I work at a bank, right? And I got a new friend there. She just kind of took to me, you know what I mean?
00:44:42 Reina: She just really did. And her husband banks there too. So he was super talkative to me. I'm like, "Oh, these people are cool." So, they helped me move into my apartment recently. And we've just been building a really good friendship and we were just talking one day.
00:45:01 Reina: It was just me and her at her house. Her husband was traveling to go see one of their kids somewhere and she stayed home. She was like, "You want to come over?" I'm like, "Yeah, let's watch movies." We're hanging out, eating snacks or whatever.
00:45:16 Reina: We're just getting to know each other. And she asked me like, "Why aren't you married?" Cuz I'm 31. She was married when she was a teenager. Like, she married her high school sweetheart. She's still married to him to this day. They have two grown children. They're fine. But they're really traditional in Indiana, right?
00:45:46 Reina: I call it the Bible belt. They're very traditional. So anyways, she was just asking questions, curious. It's fine. I felt that. I didn't feel like it was judgmental. I felt like she was just honestly curious about me. And I told her, "Well, it just never happened."
00:46:00 Reina: She was like, "Why not? And you don't have any kids?" I said, "That just really never happened." I don't know if that had to do with any of the trauma in my life before or anything. Those two things just have never even been a thing that came up.
00:46:15 Reina: So, she was like, "Well, like why? You never found anybody?" I said, "No." I asked her, I was like, "Is this a safe space for both you and I to talk freely?" And she's like, "Yeah, it is." I was like,
00:46:31 Reina: "Okay, it is for me, too." I said, "Well, I'd like to share something with you about me personally, if you don't mind." She was like, "Okay." I was like, "I have herpes." She's like, "That's okay." I was like, "Okay." So, that's why. She was like, "Oh." And then she had some other questions.
00:46:53 Reina: She's like, "When did you get it?" And then I kind of told her the surface level of how I got it, not to get into it too much. And she told me she loved me. She admired my strength. I would have never saw that. She's like, "I don't see that on you. I don't see you for that."
00:47:15 Reina: But just reading the room. Out of all the times she's come to my job talking to her, it's a buildup for me. Like I would have never went to her house if I didn't feel like it was something that I needed to put time into. You know what I mean?
00:47:31 Courtney Brame: I do. When you said "it's a buildup for me," that feels like something important to emphasize because people do wonder if and when they should tell people and if they should tell certain people in their lives and then like "how do I know that this is a person that's safe for me to tell?" And you ask—I don't think you can get more direct than that: "Is this a safe space? I want to share something with you." I also don't know anyone
00:47:58 Courtney Brame: who'd be like, "No, for real, actually it's not. I don't want to hear that s***." You know, but that wasn't the case. That wasn't your experience.
00:48:14 Courtney Brame: And you got something out of that. Like she told you, "I love you." I imagine that you're close still.
Reina: Yeah. She's picking me up at the airport in Indiana when I go home. So yeah, people are so deathly afraid.
00:48:30 Courtney Brame: And that's what I love about this podcast. I don't know if you noticed, but it's been nine years that I've been hosting this podcast and interviewing people. Sometimes I get people who are comfortable with being on camera. Most of the time I don't. And obviously video does better than audio only.
00:48:50 Courtney Brame: And it's been really difficult for me to get guests. But this is what the podcast has been useful for because you get so many unique individual experiences from different people. And that can mold your perspective and expand it and stretch it out a little bit more so that maybe something resonates that sets off a chain of neuropathways for the individual who's like, "Oh, I see my experience, myself in their story."
00:49:20 Courtney Brame: "Hearing that makes me feel like I can carry this a little bit easier or lighter." So I appreciate you sharing that because that is such a difficult thing for people to navigate and the acknowledgment of the steps to build that pathway of safety, that trust. Yeah.
00:49:44 Reina: Well, don't get me wrong. I think I told her that a couple weeks ago and we all went out to eat and I'm always just conscious of my own self. Like I don't ever double dip. I don't share anything with anybody. But I could just tell like, you know, she made a point to separate some sauces for her and her husband.
00:50:04 Reina: You know what I mean? Whereas when I first met her and I was over there for dinner, they were just like, whatever, like grab that. It's just little things that I notice. But that's okay because she has every right to protect herself.
00:50:17 Reina: And I already know that I'm going to protect others around me, period. Because I'm always going to have that in the back of my mind. I don't have to say, "Hey, like," and I don't have to get offended either. You know what I mean?
Courtney Brame: You know what? You saying that made me think.
00:50:32 Courtney Brame: I had an experience. There was someone in town that was staying with me and we had gone for a walk and when we were walking, we were waterfalling. You know how you hold the water bottle up and you don't put your mouth on it.
00:50:51 Courtney Brame: I forget who did it, who didn't. We both did it, I think. And it was hers, I want to say. And I was like, "You ain't got to do that. I don't have that one." And she was like, "Oh, I do." I was like, "Oh s***." Like,
00:51:04 Courtney Brame: we had never had that conversation. I was like, "What? I had no idea." So, we just ended up in a conversation because I just made the joke of like, "Yeah, you can't get that from me that way." And this opened up for a conversation in a way that otherwise wouldn't have happened.
00:51:23 Courtney Brame: So being sensitive and attuned to people's subtle shifts in behavior after we share information—for you to not be impacted by it and look at it like, "Well yeah I'm doing that as well. I see that you're separating sauces. I would separate sauces." Right.
00:51:42 Courtney Brame: But for someone else... and I guess this is where it comes in, the self love, the care, liking yourself, loving yourself, knowing yourself. You're able to not take offense to that.
Reina: No, I don't take anything personally anymore. You know what I mean? I'm not that shallow.
00:52:04 Reina: Like, I'm not going to take it personally. It's fine. And I also don't feel like I have to overexert myself by over-explaining either. And that's just another way of reading the room. Is this worth me diving into that right now with this person? Words have weight. But I listen, but I also watch. Body language is such a huge speaker for me, right?
00:52:44 Courtney Brame: And so like you're saying you understand with eye contact and the body language that you have is just letting me know like I need to move in a different type of way.
00:52:44 Reina: Yeah.
Courtney Brame: And this is why in-person discussions about it... like if we're sharing our status with someone, doing it over text has its purpose. Doing it on your dating app profile has its purpose, you know, but to do it in person, right? You feel out for yourself the level of safety that you have with a person.
00:53:06 Courtney Brame: You also feel out for yourself not just the level of safety that you have that that person offers to you but also what's a real response. Because even in text, if we're texting, somebody can be the most suave person over text. They can go to ChatGPT and type in, "Oh, what should I respond to this to make me seem like I'm good with women and I'm smooth?" right?
00:53:31 Courtney Brame: You can do that now. To have the real response, like our nervous systems tell us so much more than what we give credit for. And oftentimes we'll know a thing before we can rationally explain, like, "Oh, because they looked away or because they twitched or they eyes got big," you know, we pick up on these things subtly and then we're able to use that to inform whatever it is that happens next.
00:53:58 Courtney Brame: And I think we miss that when we don't have these conversations in person.
Reina: That's true. I agree.
Courtney Brame: We are approaching time. So, I want to ask, is there anything I haven't asked you that you wanted to be asked?
Reina: No, I think this is good.
00:54:18 Courtney Brame: I know you were probably expecting this to be a lot more professional than it was.
Reina: You know what? I didn't know what to expect.
Courtney Brame: Thank you. I really appreciate you sharing. I appreciate your honesty, your thoughtfulness, your vulnerability, for being someone that is out there and open about your experience.
00:54:39 Courtney Brame: Are you open to hearing from people if people want to reach out?
Reina: Of course.
Courtney Brame: And if you just said that because for the camera, you could tell me, "Courtney, you better not put my email out."
Reina: No, go ahead.
00:54:52 Reina: If they have any questions, I'm here to help. I'm here to help.
Courtney Brame: Then I can put that in the show notes. So, if you're curious to reach out to Reina, I'll put that in the show notes of the podcast episode.
00:55:08 Courtney Brame: And then is there anything else you want to leave people with before I let you go? You ain't got to think of no sick ass motivation.
Reina: Love yourself. Love yourself.
Courtney Brame: Can you open up this and say that again? The microphone was just covered.
00:55:25 Reina: All right, y'all. Love yourself. Seriously, love yourself. Life is too short. The margin for error is so small, you know. Love yourself. That's it. Choose yourself. Put yourself first no matter what.
00:55:44 Reina: Know yourself, you know. That's it. I'll leave them with that.
Courtney Brame: Thank you.
Reina: You're welcome.
Outro
Courtney Brame: That concludes this episode of Something Positive for Positive People. Please like, rate, review, share, subscribe to the podcast. If you are open to sharing your own experience and want to be a guest, reach out to me, courtney@spfpp.org.
00:56:03 Courtney Brame: I don't see that email address changing. So, that's how you can contact me or you can go to the website if you need a support call, if you want to be in a support group. Please visit the website for those. You will notice that there are now costs associated with these things. A lot of people sign up, a lot of people don't show up. A lot of people have donated and that's not been enough for them to show up either. So now we've got a little bit firmer boundaries around how to register, how much to donate when you want a support call or if you want into any of the support groups. Subscribe to the newsletter, join the newsletter.
00:56:43 Courtney Brame: And be on the lookout for upcoming future events. I'm working on stuff and yeah, I don't want to put anything timely in this podcast episode, but yeah, just stay in touch with us through the newsletter. That'll be your best bet. I am not nearly as active on social media as I used to be, just because social media don't f*** with me like that no more and people don't see my posts. All right, till next time, stay present. Thank you so much.
Reina: You're welcome.
Transcription ended after 00:56:55
